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Post by Annie Fawn on Jul 16, 2006 19:08:56 GMT -6
Laughingeyes, Cherokee culture has no rules against tatoo's I know several Cherokee's that have them. Okay, on the bigger subject of full bloods not liking mixed. I have personally come to believe that to many full bloods, it's ego talking. THEY SURVIVED the Trail of Tears, THEY LIVE on a rez, THEY didn't sale out and hide beind or marry a white to avoid being put on the rez. It's all about ego's and per cap. now a days to many full bloods and to me that is a sad thing for our people. I was raised in both worlds and danced in the circle with my dad and brother as a small child. I'm not on the rolls and neither was my dad, even though his uncles were Choctaw code talkers and he was eligible for the rolls. Like BTW I have dark brown hair and my eyes are blue/grey. You can see my picture in the pic gallery. To full bloods I look like a breed, but to many whites I just look like I have a good tan. I have always been taught it is what you feel in your heart. If your heart feels Native then you are Native. We have a friend that dances in pow wows all the time, he's our youngest daughters age, 16 and looks more white than Native, but in his heart he is Native and to him and to us that is what counts.
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Post by Unega Uwohali Waya Adkins on Jul 16, 2006 19:58:50 GMT -6
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lakotalicious
New Member
Tribal Affiliation: Oglala Lakota
Posts: 2
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Post by lakotalicious on Jul 26, 2006 23:48:35 GMT -6
I honestly don't know why the govt. makes us natives use blood quantum because only horses and dogs use that and I'm not a horse or a dog all I know is that I'm full blood Oglala Lakota
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Post by Unega Uwohali Waya Adkins on Jul 27, 2006 11:34:39 GMT -6
Yeah, me too. My mother White Feather and I having a BIG problems to keeping searching my great, great, great grandparent's full name, what year was born, where they lived at, what race they have on the list and death certifications. I'm a member of www.cherokeeshouston.org, a lady Annette Elkins Brown knows my mixed blooded Cherokee and whites history. She helped me to find out that my great, great grandfather's last name is Adkins, his full name is Thomas Hillary Adkins and his wife's full name is Emma Lavenia White. Both are half breeds Cherokee/White and her daughter's (my great grandmother) full name is Jesse Lee Adkins but she had marred, now her last name is Wollard, she's half breed Cherokee too. My mother and I cannot finding my great, great grandfather's birth and death certification and don't know where he lived at (he's unknown but he's half Cherokee) So, my mother talked to Tyler, Texas about her great grandmother's (Emma Lavenia White), they have more information about her and she can get them soon. Emma lived for 84 years, wow what a long time! My mother told me that her grand mother (Jessie) that she have Cherokee blood but can't tell her what blood quantum she have (she's hid her Cherokee blood from the Government) because IF they found out then they'll removed her and move back to N.C in Cherokee Reservation or even kill her. My Cherokees hid their color race from the Government and told them that they're Caucasians (white) and the Government typed the paper work for them. Because IF my people told them they're Cherokee then the Government will move them back to reservation and or even kill them too..... What a VERY mean Government!!!!! Jessie told my mother that her great, great grandfather who was Cherokee Chief! It'll take us a long time to keep on searching my families & tribes tree and a lot of paper work to do! because my Cherokee families & tribes told them they're " white", but my mother and I NEVER give up on the searching for our old history families & tribes tree. I'll let you know when my mother gets more information about my great, great grandmother. Welcome to the boards, lakotalicious!
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Post by Huronwoman on Jul 28, 2006 2:55:53 GMT -6
I honestly don't know why the govt. makes us natives use blood quantum because only horses and dogs use that and I'm not a horse or a dog all I know is that I'm full blood Oglala Lakota DNA testing is just one more way Big Brother has his way of keeping tabs on everyone, I Know my heritage and am proud of it, I don't have to prove it to know it and to own it, I am proud to have a full blooded Oglala Lakota Sister here! ;D Welcome to our little group of friendly people. May Wakantanka bless you today and everyday AHO
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Post by wardancer on Jul 28, 2006 18:55:18 GMT -6
My GrandMother always told us that " Blood quantums are the governments way of breeding us out of existance" I tend to agree with that and wish the tribes would do as the Cherokee and Choctaw and just prove linage. It would increase the tribal membership. It would also the amount of some of the Federal programs ( monies ) that are need based. ( based on enrollment)
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mikedart
Junior Member
Tribal Affiliation: Cherokee
Posts: 8
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Post by mikedart on Sept 19, 2006 6:27:38 GMT -6
Just to let you all know, that not all of us who are "federally recognized" fall into the category that you all have been talking about in this thread. I am an enrolled citizen of the Chjerokee Nation, which is federlaly recognized. I sympathize with those of you who are of Cherokee descent, and are not eligable for enrollment for different reasons. It think it is a shame.
As for people of high blood quantum looking down upon those of lower blood quantum...well, there are more who DON'T do that than there are who do. There will always be a few who are ignorant. It is sad that they call themselves "traditionalists" when there is nothing "traditional" about blood quantum. They have bought into the whate man's plan to divide us, and to ultimatly destroy us.
My dad wasa full blood. He so despised people who looked down on other Cherokees of lower blood quantum, and of the many Cherokee who are not eligible for enrollment, that in his later years he literally tore up his CDIB card. He kept his blue tribal citizenship card, but tore up the white CDIB where it listed his blood quantum as 4/4(full blood). He said that it was federal crap, and he didn't need a piece of paper to prove that he was Cherokee.
Anyway, just wanted to let you know that not all of us look down on those of you who are obviously Native American, and seemingly more proud to be than most of our enrolled members and tribal citzens. Just remember that the piece of paper is created by the US Government and you do not need it to prove what you are. You know it in your heart. And if you want the piece of paper just so you can take advantage of the benfits and services... well, let me tell you something: It ain't all that. Our "free healthcare" literally sucks and is of low quality and our free food commodities are un healthy and cause many of us to be obese, and also causes health problems.
And if you think we all get checks every month...well, thats also a misconception. I have been enrolled all my life, and have never gotten a check for anything from my tribe. Our casino money is misused, even though they try to say they are putting it back into the communities, and into our health care system. yeah right! Tribal politics are more crooked than regular politics.
Just to let you know, that being federally recognized isn't all it's cracked up to be.
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Post by Huronwoman on Sept 23, 2006 0:51:00 GMT -6
Wado!!!
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Post by Unega Uwohali Waya Adkins on Sept 23, 2006 20:39:08 GMT -6
WADO Mikedart for let us know more information about full or less Cherokee blooded!!!
I have been learning more about Cherokees and their's way.
I have Cherokee's way and not to trust the U.S Government.
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Post by laughingeyes on Sept 23, 2006 21:33:23 GMT -6
i have a question and ive been wondering about this for awhile now. do you have to have a tribal card if you put down that you are native american on like a application ,or anything like that ?can any one give a answer on this one?
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mikedart
Junior Member
Tribal Affiliation: Cherokee
Posts: 8
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Post by mikedart on Sept 23, 2006 22:00:37 GMT -6
hello laughing eyes. Yes you must have at least a CDIB card to claim that you are native american on an application for employment or housing assitance...or anything for that matter. Even still, if you look white, even if you have a tribal card, they will still sometimes put you down as causasion anyway.
And another thing some of you all who do art probably need to know. In order to sell you art as "Native American" you have to be enrolled in a federally recognized tribe. This is according the the Indian Arts Act of 1990. You can get in a lot of trouble if you are caught trying to sell your work as Native American made if you do not have your tribal card. Not that I agree, but I wouldn't want to see any of you get in trouble. This is taken very seriously in oklahoma and the fines are very high...some as high as 150,000.00 believe it or not. I will try to find the Indian Arts Act link and post it up here for you all to read.
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mikedart
Junior Member
Tribal Affiliation: Cherokee
Posts: 8
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Post by mikedart on Sept 23, 2006 22:05:58 GMT -6
Something else I want to correct that was in this thread.... someone said that we live on a rez. The Cherokees in Oklahoma do not now, nor have we ever had a reservation. Our land was given to us by treaty, then taken away and divided into small individual land allotments after Oklahoma statehood. There is only one tribe in oklahoma who actually have what would be considered a reservation, and that is the Osage Nation. Our land here in oklahoma was ran by our own people, and not overseen by the US Army like reservations were.
Even the Eastern band who lives in north Caroline does not have a reservaton. They call it that for tourism purposes, but it is actually land that the tribe bought themself, and is now held in trust by the US. Not the same thing as a reservation...
Just wanted to clear that up.
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Post by cherosage on Sept 29, 2006 0:29:05 GMT -6
I must agree that the root to our evil is the almighty Dollar$$$$$$. I really hate to see people get played by the skin gamers. I think some of you may know what I'm talking about. I grew up knowing I'm NDN though it wasn't OK to talk about in public. I grew up and know many that you would not know is NDN and some that is the Stereotypical NDN. We're not as dark as some, though we do have some dark hair, ect. My Grandma was white headed by the time she was about 35 yrs old. My Grandma was sent to a Catholic Boarding school when she was very young. She was the only child in her family that was sent away in this manor. She was very against being called NDN though she was. My grandpas didn't talk much of being NDN either. In MO it wasn't popular until the mid to late '60s to be OK to talk about NDN things. Even Up to the late '70s it was illegal for NDNs to be residents of the State of MO or own property.
I have a GreatGrandpa who was Welsh, do you suppose his Mom was a Princess. By the way he did marry a nice very pretty NDN girl and they had a family. I didn't know him, he passed before I was born, But I didknow my Greatgrandma. She was a small lady. My Grandmapassed giving birth to my Mom. My Mom is Cherokee and Chicasaw.
I am Cherokee, Osage, Shawnee and Chicasaw. My wife is Lipan Apache and Aztec.
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Post by cherosage on Sept 29, 2006 0:46:43 GMT -6
thanks Mikedart. I know that there are Cherokees, and some other of what is called the 5 civilized tribes using the Dawes Rolls as their base, that were not enrolled because of where they lived, whether they chose to enroll or not, ect.. Often not all members of a family(siblings) enrolled. If you are a family member directly in line of one who didn't enroll, you will never enroll. This is true even if your first cousins are full blood tribal members.
I know some of our history and I have learned much about many of the so called splinter groups of Cherokees. I believe that many are truely NDN and just can't get enrolled. I don't think of them as any less NDN just because they aren't Fed. Enrolled, "Carded".
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Post by cherosage on Sept 29, 2006 0:49:32 GMT -6
You know, another thing. Whites don't have to carry a card telling anyone how much Irish, Scot, English, German, French etc, they are. the Blacks don't carry acard telling their pedigree. this is just a thouhgt.
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mikedart
Junior Member
Tribal Affiliation: Cherokee
Posts: 8
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Post by mikedart on Sept 29, 2006 12:20:40 GMT -6
exactly, cherosage! We are the ONLY race of people on this earth who have to have a little card to prove what we are, at least to the government of the united states that is. Sad, huh?
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Post by laughingeyes on Sept 29, 2006 18:44:25 GMT -6
it is sad that we have to have a card to tell and show who we are .its not right
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Post by Unega Uwohali Waya Adkins on Sept 30, 2006 22:40:44 GMT -6
I agreed that, laughingeyes. I wish the Government change it and no need to prove card for NDN people only. I'm tired of this Major problems trying to get that d**n card!
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Post by laughingeyes on Oct 1, 2006 19:59:50 GMT -6
yes me too ,i would like to see how far they would go if they had to go though all this bull sh--, than maybe they would open their eyes and change a few things .
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Post by Huronwoman on Oct 3, 2006 7:00:05 GMT -6
I am very upset that I had to tell the people at the hospital when I had my neck surgery 6 times and then present them with my TINEA (Texas Inter-tribal Native Enrollment Agency) card before they would put my race as NDN instead of white because I have blue eyes and fair skin. My word should be good enough. I only need a card to prove to whites that I am NDN not to myself or other Native Americans. TINEA is not the same as a BIA card it is strictly a census so that we may be able to let the legislature know how many of us there are in Texas and to present possible bills to be made into law. But I really dislike having to present a card to prove who I am. I know and the Creator knows and really that's all that is important. AHO
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Post by indian-heart-beat on Oct 3, 2006 16:40:26 GMT -6
I am very upset that I had to tell the people at the hospital when I had my neck surgery 6 times and then present them with my TINEA (Texas Inter-tribal Native Enrollment Agency) card before they would put my race as NDN instead of white because I have blue eyes and fair skin. My word should be good enough. I only need a card to prove to whites that I am NDN not to myself or other Native Americans. TINEA is not the same as a BIA card it is strictly a census so that we may be able to let the legislature know how many of us there are in Texas and to present possible bills to be made into law. But I really dislike having to present a card to prove who I am. I know and the Creator knows and really that's all that is important. AHO Yes, I can imagine how you felt... this situation is incredible and sad. So...if you colored your skin and wore brown lenses they would not have asked you to show that card?
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Post by Unega Uwohali Waya Adkins on Oct 3, 2006 16:57:30 GMT -6
Sorry to heard that, Huronwoman.....
That's a good idea, hope it does help Huronwoman to make NDN look and show card to them.
Try to use tanning bed to get dark tan skin and worn brown eye lenses.
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Post by Huronwoman on Oct 5, 2006 23:37:41 GMT -6
Many Native American with more percentage of blood than I, look whiter than I doesn't make them less of an Indian or more of an Indian, I will not alter my appearance with the exception of covering some of my gray hair for anyone's sake, I am who and what I am, quite a few Huron and many Cherokee have blue eyes and are light complected. We came from snow country where blue eyes were a blessing against snow blindness. my brother has black eyes and a darker complexion my other brother who just passed had a darker complexion and hazel eyes - go figure!
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Post by cherosage on Jan 15, 2007 0:47:01 GMT -6
Just some more thoughts on this subject. I have heard that during the Dawes enrollment those who were not currently living in the territory they were enrolling were unable to enroll. I had family who lived in MO at the time. They tried to enroll but were put into the unenrollable pile, just because they lived in MO. This was also true of some other tribes. This Enrollment thing was also a problem with those Elders who said that they would not put their name on the Fed's papers. Now their families are not eligible to enroll with their Tribes. I would hope that the OK Cherokees would open our Rolls to those eligible otherwise, perhaps in a different category. I pray that we could recognize all Cherokees and not just those of the OK territory. I had some family living in Texas at that time and were not enrolled for some reason. Anyone who knows of the Robert Shaw Hamilton family from Texas,Dallas area(?), please let me know. I would also like to know some info about the Manspeaker Family.
I want to pray for those of the Freedman Rolls. Chad Smith is trying to kick them out. I think this could lead to a costly Lawsuit
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maskwa
New Member
Cree Celtic Dreamcatcher
Posts: 3
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Post by maskwa on Oct 31, 2007 10:29:26 GMT -6
Its funny my blood is thick, but I wasn't brought up that way. I am still in the process of finding my natural family by going through the Manitoba repatriation society but it is hard because the adoption agency had a fire in 1962 and many records were lost mine included.
There is a key importance to the statement "All my relations" that many over look because of learned societal prejudice, and we should all know that it is wrong to use prejudice as a means to our lives. Negativity begets more negativity, and negativity will destroy our lives if we let it. No matter what, we should all be welcoming, and embracing each other to our awakenings or our knowledges of being within a strengthened band, or fall to being divided and weakly alone. It not only hurts the person that this is being done to, but also the person themselves, as it degrades their spirit too. We know that this is not the nature of love. It would be better to be blind, and accept a loving heart, and soul into the family, than to be sighted, and stupidly hateful of others.
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Post by bigelk on Nov 24, 2008 17:11:58 GMT -6
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Post by ndnchickasawpride on Feb 15, 2009 21:51:05 GMT -6
I'm Part Chickasaw & Black , My Father is Part Indian & Black , My Granny is Part Indian & Black , My great grand mother is Full blooded Chickasaw .
& it is funny how Generation after the next the Decendance Of my Great Grandmother who's of Native American slowly started looking more African American .......lol for A long time I Just thought I Was Black .......lol until I met my Great Grandmother who looks very Indian & then I was told that my Fathers Mothers , Mother (My Great Grandmother & Her Family ) are Full Blooded Indians & that my Great Grandmother Married A Black Negro & had 7 Kids which were My Granny & Her sisters & brothers , Some were listed on the Indian Dawes Roll as Fullbloods due to them looking Full blooded Indian Including my Grandmother Who's listed on the roll as A Fullblood , However Some of them weren't listed as Fullbloods & were listed on The Freedmen Black Indian roll however all 7 of my Great Grandmothers kids were able to Obtain their CDIB Cards & Roll numbers due to my great Granny signing them up as her kids who were half Black .
so to me Its funny most of us don't even Claim we're Indian unless we can get A CDIB Card out of it which is sad .....
I however is applying for mine CDIB Card , but not get get anything out of it , but I generally would love to learn my Indian Heritage , Join Chickasaw Activties , Learn the Chickasaw Language & be able to fully experience my Great Grandmothers People , My People , The Native American People , & Be proud of who i'am & not just hold A CDIB Card just to get something Free because some nuts isn't Free , to to get my CDIB Card as 100% pride of my Native American Culture & Heritage ...
Many people only get A CDIB Card cause they want the Free Benefits , But i want mine to Be proud of who i'am ...
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Post by bearfoot on Feb 15, 2009 22:50:55 GMT -6
Welocme. A very interesting mix in your heritage.
I only want to know for me, too. But, I don't care about the card. I have no one to prove it to. If I know for me, that is good enough.
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Post by 2shadows on Feb 16, 2009 13:53:57 GMT -6
I agree with bearfoot..WELCOME ndnchickasawpride
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Post by bearfoot on Feb 17, 2009 11:41:44 GMT -6
I am intrigued about your blood line, and how you say that many family members looked full blooded. Is there any chance you would post a picture of you?
We can start a picture thread here...something like "Show us what you look like"....? I will post mine there, too. We can already see White Eagle and 2shadows on here...by their avitars, but I bet they would add some other photos, too.
I have pictures on a thread here of my Great Grandmother, and her son, my Grandfather. I wish to know if they look Cherokee...or if I have the wrong tribe. I am not having luck with the Dawes Rolls. I need a firm direction to look at next.
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